149892-friends-of-rotostar-datamine-currently-free-aspects-going-behind-a-paywall
Content ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- ---- Agreed. There are enough tidbits there to get people interested but I'd very much like to hear the details straight from Carbine. | |} ---- I'd be ok if they "grand-fathered in" all existing characters right now, but any new characters created on a F2P account would have the lower stack limits to contend with. | |} ---- ---- ---- I find 250 very limiting at the momment. That would be a good bonus for subscribers. | |} ---- Well, QoL things are exactly what should be put behind a pay wall. We can discuss which QoL are really just fluff or very onerous. Making your in-place revive CD shorter would be a QoL change, having F2P suffer through a 1hour CD on it would be very onerous indeed. Having a larger stack size for mats is one of the QoL's that should be behind the paywall. I do agree you shouldn't take away now what F2P got used to, so bump up the size for signature players. You would have to come up with some idea what you'll do when someone drops off signature. Leave existing stacks as is, but you can't add to a stack anymore that's over the limit? Similar to what they are doing for character slots. Edited February 27, 2016 by Elo'naa | |} ---- ---- ---- Probably originated in English and is being translated to Chinese. Not that there aren't some things I like in this, free lockbox key a day and potentially higher tradeskill item stacks, but I don't see them rebranding their Signature and Cosmic points so soon. | |} ---- ---- I did not have concerns. I had hopes that you were adding value to our Signature service. | |} ---- I thought that part was clear. However thanks for clearing up that it's for the China release. Though no, concerns aren't eased. I will always have concerns with a business model that focusses on selling skins, animation bundles and subscriptions that remove inconveniences or provide small time saving bonuses instead of on selling a game based on the qualities of the game. | |} ---- So you missed the memo about the tripling of omnibit drop rate and weekly cap then? It's a free to play game, the current market demands free to play as most people nowdays wont even look twice at an online game they have to hand over money to even check out. Having "great qualities" in your free to play game that is IMO incredibly generous as it is, means people don't have to spend money on the game so Carbine have to focus on the shop a bit to generate an income to support the game. Makes sense yeah? Now previously before all the positive information and changes that have come about in the last few weeks your concern was probably warranted, now however, value has been added to signature, servers are being merged (with free xfers in the meantime) and drop 7 is hopefully not much over a month away along with the Steam release. Things are looking the best they've ever looked for Wildstar IMO. | |} ---- ---- Then explain to me what you mean because I don't understand what you're trying to say. Basically it was "I'm concerned they are focusing on selling shop items instead of...", but what on earth do you mean by "selling the game based on the qualities of the game"? | |} ---- The increased drops are nice but Signature benefits still pale next to the sub perks in SWTOR, ESO, Tera and (ugh) even Daybreak's games. The mention of Lockbox Keys was what most interested me. | |} ---- You can buy the lockbox keys with with Omni bits, I'm pretty sure you could in the last lockbox event anyway. | |} ---- TOR's model centers around how badly they punish non-subs. Comparing the perks between Wildstar and SW:TOR I find Wildstar has a bit of an edge over TOR but on the whole they're comparable. Every other difference comes down to the utter load of manure TOR drags their non-subs through. It's a rather despicable model IMO. I prefer TOR's monthly cash shop currency grant over Wildstar's grindable Omnibits, but WS's is quite a bit more generous depending on how much of the weekly cap you fill. Service Tokens are still around but the expanded limit helps mitigate that to some extent. There was some speculation that that was the case. I appreciate the clarification. I also very much appreciate the willingness to discuss datamined content. TOR's hostility towards that sort of discussion combined with their near complete silence on future plans has created a huge amount of customer frustration with their team. | |} ---- They did say from the very beginning that they wanted to make their F2P model to be as friendly(for lack of a better term, brain's still waking up :P ) as possible, they didn't want the F2P'ers to feel like they are being punished. If you don't feel that your sub has value, than be a F2P, with the Cosmic Points you've most likely accrued you won't be limited at all. I really don't care that a F2P person has almost as much access to the game as I do, with just a few limitations. And as PlasmaJohn pointed out, most of those other models seem to be more about punishing a F2P as opposed to making a sub seem more valuable. To me, my sub doesn't have value because the F2P'ers are getting punished for not paying to play the game, I pay to play this game because I have fun with it and I feel that fun is still worth $15'ish a month(sometimes $20 a month because I bought a few CREDD, I wanted a little boost in my Cosmic Points :P ) . | |} ---- Special offers for subbed players would've been cool too. | |} ---- and dont they limit content in those games if you are not a sub? so it is kind of talking apples and oranges, but I do agree that this sub could be more appealing. the recent omni bit change was a step in the right direction. while a sub in this game is a little lack luster, it does not limit what content you can do. so to say it pales in comparison is right, because you actually get more content with their sub. here you get everything for free. so it is a tricky comparison to make as this business model is really generous for free bots. but in order to make a profit they need to monetize things ingame, and i do not think anything talked about is something that I would say "thats not right". all content is playable, but QoL things, costumes, dye, mounts, and other vanity items are totally fair game to monetize imo. | |} ---- And therein lies the problem. For people like me that don't care about cash shop gambling boxes, vanity costumes and the like, there is nothing to pay for. In fact, loading up the cash shop like SWTOR does and ignoring any in game activity rewards will drive people like me away due to not having any carrots to chase. At least, it would cause people like me to stop paying for Signature. The f2p model in this game is FAR too generous in comparison to Signature. The cat's out of the bag on that, though. Taking things away would seriously *cupcake* off a lot of people. So, what can Carbine do to make Signature worth paying for? My Signature payment went through for March a couple of days ago. Unless more happens to differentiate it from not paying, it will be the last one. That is not a threat, it's feedback. There was thread back in January where a few people posted things that would really incentivize going Signature. Sunshine liked a few of them and promised to pass the word along. The first hint that they listened is the Omni-bit stuff. Again, it's a nice gesture but is it enough to offset spending $15/mo on N-Coin instead? Edited March 1, 2016 by Makillda | |} ---- Those games all focus on punishing non-subs; But in reality subs there get as much or less than we do in W*. It only seems like more because you literally are hindered as a free player. PlasmaJohn has it pretty much right, W* is extremely generous period. Pretty much on spot. On a personal note: I actually prefer W*'s method of Omnibit accrual versus SWTOR's allowance; because one incentivises just paying; while the other incentives paying AND completing content (granted that's just my opinion; YMMV) | |} ---- yeah if you dont like to spend on vanity items on the cash shop, this game will not entice you to spend money. but the way i look at it i am earning omni bits at a 4-1 rate now with all my perks. so this earns me more omni bits, dollar wise, than I am paying for my sub. makes it worth it for me, as i also enjoy vanity items. but for someone as yourself, it would still be useless. and to your last point, i am earning more currency for use in the cash shop via omni bits than i would get paying actual money. so the sub is actually worth it as far as trading $$ for pixels, and you can actually make out if you have all the cosmic reward bonuses. Edited March 1, 2016 by Foul Wind | |} ---- If you're looking at it purely in terms of NCoin, then you would be better off subscribing. The increase of 240 Omnibits per week gives you a good possibility of making that $15 back in Omnibits on top of what you'd get normally plus the Signature bonuses. Of course, that is subject to how much you play. There's a good side and bad side to it. The good, which I agree with you on, is that it incentivizes playing. If you want those extra 240 Omnibits every week, you have to get in the game and actually participate. You can't just pay $15 a month, sit back, and accrue shop currency. The more concurrent people we have online playing, the better. The bad side to this, however, is that it also imposes a time commitment on Signature. If you're in it for the Omnibits, then you have to make sure you're playing enough to actually make it worth your while. If something comes up and I can't commit as much time to the game, then there isn't much benefit to me keeping my subscription going. If I take a break from SWtoR, I'll continue to earn 500 Cartel Coins and have that to come back to. If I take a break from Wildstar, that Omnibit bonus isn't going to be doing much for me, meaning there's no reason to keep my subscription going. That's why I thought we were seeing this Rotostar stuff pop up. It looks sort of like a veteran reward system where, the longer you are subscribed, the more bonuses you earn. Something like that could be beneficial to Wildstar on top of the Omnibit increase due to making people to reconsider whether or not they want to cancel their subscription rather than how it is now, where you can start and stop it based on your playtime with little impact. | |} ---- ---- Don't get me wrong, I'd like to see some more interesting things for subs. That said, I'm VERY thankful for the system in place and the virtual lack of punishment for F2Players in W* compared to other F2P games. Some cool exclusives and more nifty bonuses would be great for us subs; but also be careful what we wish for; the current system is (while not perfect) quite good, and it would be a shame to damage it by punishing F2Players, rather than adding value for sub players. | |} ---- Here's the breakdown: If you play enough to hit the cap every week of the month, that relaxed cap gets you 240 Omnibits per week over the F2P cap. If we assume spherical cow and round the month down to four weeks, that's 960 Omnibits. For the same $15, you can get 1200 NCoin. Now, there are a couple of things you can only get with NCoin, but for everything else in the store, the Omnibit price is half the price in NCoins, so you're grinding out the value of 1920 NCoin in four weeks if you cap every week. Me? I've hit the cap a couple times total. Grinding to the higher cap takes longer, because you're earning two bits for one but the cap is three times as high. Even if I can only be arsed to do content to the cap every other week, I'll be pulling in 960 NCoin equivalent on Signature. Since grinding that much more is going to amount to more Elder Gems and cash, those increased rates of income are of greater value. Now, even with all of the Cosmic perks scratched out, I'm still getting more for my money, because EG and plat buy things you can't get with store currency (things like runes and repairs and consumables and stopgap equipment and so forth, for those of us who don't care about cash shop gambling boxes, vanity costumes and the like). Edited March 1, 2016 by Shendorion | |} ---- The cap is 3x as high and you earn 3x as many Omnibits. So, it should take just as long to hit the cap now as it did before. The way Carbine has chosen to word it is a little confusing. When I saw 200% increase, I assumed that meant double (1 x 2.00). They mean 200% more (1 + 1 x 2.00). It's only slower to reach the cap now for people who have the Cosmic Reward. It used to be 2 per drop with a 120 cap (60 drops needed). Now it's 4 per drop with a 360 cap (90 drops needed). Though, even if you still only get 60 drops in a week, you'll be getting twice as many as you used to. Edited March 1, 2016 by Cantatus | |} ---- The pitfalls of multiple revisions. I used to have sentence in there stating the grind was a minor quibble :lol:. Debating pulling the trigger on a multi-month sub so I can hit the accelerated rate. And because I think the sub is now worth it. Just wish I could transfer some of my bought CREDD instead of putting it up on the CREDD exchange. | |} ---- ---- ----